Today we’re blessed to have guest Kent Sanders, who is the founder of Inkwell Ghostwriting, which helps leaders grow their business through books and other content. He is also the author and co-author of numerous books, including 18 Words to Live By: A Father’s Wisdom on What Matters Most and co-author of The Faith of Elvis: A Story Only a Brother Can Tell with Billy Stanley, Elvis Presley’s stepbrother.
In addition to writing books for himself and his clients. Kent loves to help other writers. He is the host of The Daily Writer podcast, and the founder of The Daily Writer Club, a membership community that helps writers build a business with their skills. He lives just outside of St. Louis, and enjoys spending time outdoors with his wife and teenage son.
Welcome, Kent. It’s so good to have you on the show.
Kent Sanders 01:23
Thank you so much. It’s great to be here.
Dalene Bickel 01:25
What a great background there. So I’m curious … one question I always ask my guests is: What is one book, in addition to the Bible, that has significantly impacted you in some way?
Kent Sanders 01:43
That’s a good question. When I was prepping for this, I really had to think hard about what my response would be. Because like most people who are into books and writing, it’s really hard to nail that down. But if I had to pick one, it would be a little short book that came out in the mid-1990s, called In the Name of Jesus: Reflections on Christian Leadership by Henri Nouwen.
He was a Catholic priest who actually left a couple of prestigious positions at universities like Harvard, Yale, and so forth to go work with a community of people in Canada who were learning challenged, and he wrote a little book about it. Basically, it’s all about a view of Christian leadership that’s very servant oriented; how our greatest power really comes from our brokenness and our weakness. It’s a totally contradictory view to how people normally look at leadership.
Plus, it’s a little short book; it’s very story driven. You can read it in about an hour. And it’s really impacted the way that I view ministry and leadership since I was in college, when I first read it. So I love that book. I would highly recommend it to anybody.
I think a point to mention here is that it’s such a short book. For all of you writers out there:
You don’t have to write a full-length novel to make an impact. It’s all about the words that you’re sharing; you don’t have to meet a certain word count.
It’s whatever shares your story the best.
I totally agree.
What Is a Generous Writer?
I asked you to come on [to Ink and Impact] because I’ve heard you speaking recently about the concept of generosity as a writer. I would love to discuss that with you today with my listeners. Let’s start out with: What is your basic definition of generosity, in general?
Well, generosity is not just any one thing that you do; it’s not just one single act. I think generosity is a lifestyle or kind of like … I guess you could say it’s an orientation or a way that you really approach the world.
I think generosity is important, because, well, number one, it’s just the way that Jesus lived. I mean, if you think of who is the most generous person in history, if you think of God’s grace and mercy to us, I mean, that’s a pretty generous concept. Not that the faith-based thing is necessarily like, “Well, we’re gonna take that and just make it into a business thing.” That’s not really what I mean. But I think kind of a life perspective. Being generous is the is one of the best ways that we can mirror how Jesus lived and how God approaches us and his relationship with Him.
Plus, I think if you do want to look at it from a business standpoint, it’s the best way to build relationships and to network with people, and just to be a giver, and to have more joy in your life. So, I think there’s a lot of benefits to approaching life in a generous way.
For writers, sometimes I think it’s a bit of a challenge, because we think of things like networking or building relationships, or we look at those kinds of things as a very external or an extroverted kind of thing. But many writers are kind of introverted. I’m an introvert. So, we think of those things and a lot of people shrink back from that because we automatically think it’s going to require some crazy amount of energy from us or for us to become somebody that we’re not.
I don’t think it’s that way at all.
You can practice generosity in a lot of different ways, doing it in accordance with how you’re wired and what your personality is. I think that’s really the key to it, in my opinion.
Why It’s Important to Be a Generous Writer
Dalene Bickel 05:01
I agree. I don’t want to skip ahead too far, but you did mention about generosity for writers and about how we think of it as being networking and that kind of thing. What are some other reasons why it would be important for writers to be generous, and maybe a couple of ideas of how they can be generous?
Kent Sanders 05:18
Sure. I think one of the biggest reasons, honestly, is because it’s more fun when you think of how are you going to develop relationships with people? How are you going to build your business?
People sometimes look at business as this kind of impersonal force in our lives, or this impersonal part of society, you know? We think of that famous line from The Godfather movie from the early 1970s, where they say, “It’s business, not personal.” But I totally disagree with that.
I think there’s nothing more personal than business. Business is an exchange of value. It means I value your product or service enough to give you something of value that I have, which, of course, is money. So, I think in that sense, it’s very, very personal.
That’s the best way I think, to do business is to be a person who is giving, who is generous, who is always trying to add value to other people, regardless of whether you always get something back. It’s just a great way to approach the world and to be a more joyful person. And to take the pressure off, especially if you’re an introvert like I am, or if you don’t want to go to all the networking meetings and feel like you have to do all those things.
Way #1 to Become a Generous Writer
One great way is to leave book reviews and podcast reviews for people. You mentioned The Faith of Elvis book in your intro. Of course, I would love to have reviews for that, because I was a co-author on the book and book reviews are great.
But also I love to leave reviews for other people. In fact, I was leaving some just a few days ago just thinking, Oh man, I’ve got this friend, he came out with a book recently and I hadn’t yet left a review. So I go on Amazon, leave my reviews, and so forth. That’s something very simple we can do for podcasters and authors.
Dalene Bickel 06:55
I just want to pause there for a second because I think as writers and authors who have published books already, we’re always asking our readers to leave those reviews. But so often, we don’t think that we can support other writers in that way.
And I love how you’re bringing that out … that’s a great way for us to be generous in our time – but it doesn’t take that long. Just to be generous with our time and with our comments, and it is an easy way to support each other. Thank you.
Kent Sanders 07:27
Yeah, totally. I guess the way I look at it is, it kind of goes back to the basic principle of doing for other people what you would have them do for you. It all goes back to the Bible, really, in some ways. And I think, what is it that writers and authors really want?
We want reviews, we want book sales, and we want people to promote our stuff.
At the end of the day, those three things are things that are really important to us as authors and things that we want other people to do for us. So, we can do those for other people first to establish a dynamic of generosity and of giving. Many times, people will reciprocate. Sometimes they don’t. And that’s okay. We’ve still gone out there and done what we can to support other people.
Those are very, very simple things to do. And they don’t take that much time.
I think if you’re a writer, that should come really naturally to you to do stuff like:
- leaving reviews,
- leaving comments on people’s social media posts,
- sharing other people’s posts.
I mean, this is what we do. We are writers. So those kinds of things should come very, very easy to us.
Do Love and Generosity Have a Place in Business?
Dalene Bickel 08:30
I agree. And I love how you’re sharing that generosity doesn’t have to be difficult. But I’m also trying to think in the mind of a writer or as anyone listening to the show who might be thinking, “Okay, as an author, you become a business person, whether you like it or not.”
You become an entrepreneur, because you’re in charge of sales and all that. So then we get into the marketing mindset of sales, sales, sales. How can we shift that mindset into one of generosity when we’re thinking about book sales?
Kent Sanders 08:58
Well, I do think you have to think strategically about sales. We’re never gonna get away from where we have to think about strategy and marketing and all the things that we need to do. You know, if you’re running Amazon ads, for example, or Google ads, or something like that, you’ve got to know how those work and understand the principles behind that and the investment that goes into it and all those things.
I don’t think that generosity necessarily excuses us from having to know the intricacies of the things that we need to do as a business person. But being generous, I think, is a great approach because it frames why we’re doing those things.
So, as an author, yes, I want book sales. Yes, I want all those things. But why am I doing that to begin with? I’m doing it because I think that I have something of value to share with people.
To me, the very act of writing a book, and of being author in the first place, is an act of love and of generosity to the world because we’ve gone to the trouble of crafting a book or some other kind of resource that can bless people by helping them in some way or entertaining them or inspiring them.
The whole process – from beginning to end, even including the business and marketing side – is really an act of generosity and of love for people. I know we don’t like to toss around the word “love” a lot of times in business circles because it’s kind of touchy feely, but I think we shouldn’t shy away from it., especially if you’re a person of faith.
I mean, my goodness, everything that we do should be framed by love – even what we do in business.
How Generous Should You Be with Your Lead Magnet?
Dalene Bickel 10:27
That’s what Jesus commanded us, right? The old law was gone, the new law is love.
One of the things that I was thinking of [that could be considered] generous to readers is our opt-in offer or our freebies, and those monthly newsletters. What can you share about that?
Kent Sanders 10:49
Well, those are really important.
I think you have to give something of value first to your readers before you can expect something from them.
I know that conventional wisdom is to give away some kind of short checklist or like a one-page PDF, or something as your lead magnet, which can be totally great – those can be very, very helpful. I’ve downloaded a million of those myself.
However, I actually went to the other side of it. Sometimes I do things totally backwards, or the opposite of what everybody says. Sometimes that works, sometimes it doesn’t; we’re all kind of trying to figure out what works because things change so fast. I actually have seven different guides. So when people go to DailyWriterLife.com, there’s a link to sign up for the free Daily Writer Starter Kit [that consists of] seven short ebooks on different topics for writers.
I think you just have to experiment with it and see what works and try to understand what your audience wants. And man, I just really think putting together something great that they would normally pay for.
A lot of times we think of lead magnets as something that you just kind of throw together and put out there. But I think if you could put together something really cool – something that people would pay for – give it to them for free. To me that sets the tone of, “Hey, I’m gonna give you something really, really valuable here at the beginning. And that’s going to set a tone for our relationship.” That’s the way I think about it at least.
Can You Be Too Generous?
Dalene Bickel 12:20
And that also shows the quality that you’ll provide even down the road, right? Like you said, setting the tone.
Now, this is purely opinion, but is there a time that you can become too generous?
Kent Sanders 12:34
Oh, I think so. I’m a professional ghostwriter and have been doing that for a while now. There’s not always a clear-cut line between what you should give away and what you should charge for. Essentially, the way that I look at it is – and maybe this isn’t directly answering your question, but I guess it kind of is, in a way – okay, you’re going to pay my rate, whatever that is at the time. Generally, I’m not going to discount it just out of the fact that my time is valuable and I bring a certain level of expertise to it and skills and all that stuff. Same way for you, Dalene, you have a certain skill set that you use in writing and dealing with clients.
But there are some times that I do just give away things because maybe it’s a pro bono thing, maybe it’s a cause or an organization that I really care about. So, I kind of look at it as it’s either free or full price; I don’t really do discount kinds of things. Now, that being said, it all depends on the situation. If it seems warranted, or if it seems called for or whatever. It’s totally a judgment call and just depends on the specifics of whatever we’re talking about. Yeah, that’s kind of how I think about it.
Dalene Bickel 13:41
I would add that in my own experience … years ago, when I was first starting my business and everything, the concept wasn’t necessarily “try and be generous,” but simply “give things away.”
But then there comes a time that you do have to start charging if you want to earn an income and run a business. If you’re writing as a hobby, and it’s just something that you completely enjoy doing pro bono, there’s nothing wrong with that. But if you’re wanting to become a paid author and make that your business, then there is a time that you need to start generating income.
Kent Sanders 14:12
Absolutely. I totally agree with that. I will say that I had a kind of a mind shift about this, probably six or eight months ago. Up until then, I had basically been a solo ghostwriter. But I got really, really busy. Actually, what brought this about was The Faith of Elvis book. I had several projects I was working on, starting about this time last year, so fall of 2021. Then the Elvis book came along and they had a super quick deadline for that. So that forced me to hire some help for one of the client books that I was working on. So I hired another writer for that and it went fine.
But then I had another book come along that was a gigantic research-driven book. The Elvis book was done and I was like, “Man, I’m gonna spend like six months doing a deep dive into this book. And that’s kind of the only thing I can focus on unless I hire some help.” So I hired some help and it actually went really, really well. A friend of mine who’s a former college professor, just like I am, came along and assisted with some writing on this project. It was so helpful.
The thing that I learned from this project was that if I charge enough for my services, that allows me to then hire other people and help them. So if I’m always kind of bottom of the barrel, and I’m always afraid to raise my rates, that actually prevents me from serving my clients in the best way that I can [and forces me] to take on more projects to pay the bills. I also can’t bless anybody else by hiring them.
So the more that I increase in my skills and my value, and the more that I charge, [the more I can] bless other people by hiring them and I can give away more; I have more options with my time.
There’s a lot of good in that, even though that’s really a challenging thing to do, mindset wise.
Dalene Bickel 15:53
Oh, I agree. That’s a great perspective there. Thank you for sharing that tangible experience that you had; it really helps us to get a mind’s eye on what we’re talking about here.
I had been looking on your website, and you have a blog, as you mentioned, and I don’t remember how long ago this was posted, but it was about your art being worth the risk. And you were saying how people have to take a risk; I think you gave the example of someone that was pitching an agent or sending it to you for your review or something like that, before they send it to an agent.
And I got to thinking, you know, that’s kind of a type of generosity as well, when we’re willing to share our writing with someone for their opinion before we make it public. I think that that’s a great way to be generous by letting the other person know, “Hey, I really value your opinion; I value your feedback.”
Do you agree with that?
Kent Sanders 16:44
I do. There’s kind of an inherent generosity in sharing anything, really, that’s of a creative nature. And really, I think we all do that in our jobs; any kind of a job. This to me is not just something that writers or artists deal with. It’s something that everybody deals with.
My wife works for a company close to downtown St. Louis, where she helps people choose stone for their countertops in their kitchens. It’s a very high-end company. People who are building really nice homes come in, and they will pick out stone, they work with fabricators and the clients and the builders and all that stuff.
She is very artful in what she does. She’s very thoughtful. And she’s bringing a lot of value in generosity when she’s dealing with people in choosing these things, which is essentially a creative decision, you know, for what kind of materials you’re going to put in your home and countertops and those kinds of things.
But it’s also risky because when you’re putting yourself out there and sharing your opinions and sharing your creative gifts with the world. No matter what type of job it is, you’re always opening yourself up to criticism. I mean, my goodness, contractors deal with that every day, attorneys deal with that, teachers deal with that.
So it’s not unique to writers and artists, but for some reason, there is kind of a funny thing where people feel okay with sharing their opinions about music, and movies, and books, and those kinds of things in a way that sometimes they don’t share with other kinds of things in society. I’m not sure why that is. But it’s just something that we kind of have to learn to deal with.
When we put our heart out there into the world, people can stomp on it. I mean, it just happens. And in fact, with The Faith of Elvis, there’s a review or two on Amazon, where people were not too happy with the book. Now, that’s like the minority of people. But I realized, you know, that happens. I personally think they didn’t really understand the concept of the book. In fact, I’m not even sure they even read the title or the book description. If so, you wouldn’t be saying these things in your review. That’s totally beside the point.
But that’s what happens when you put your work out there. People can trash it if they want to, they can criticize it. So you kind of have to decide, am I going to be a big boy or big girl? And am I willing to put up with the risk of putting my art out there? A lot more people are gonna like it than don’t like it.
Dalene Bickel 19:01
There’s definitely risk involved. And it’s definitely overcoming fears. But I think it all comes back to the fact that you have to step out of your isolation, and you have to connect with other people.
That theme has been coming up in so many of my episodes lately. It’s interesting. So I think my own feeling on all of this is because there are such fine lines between not being generous or being too generous, or there’s fear. Sometimes there’s fear that is just in our own mind and then there’s legitimate fear, too. And so there’re all these little tight ropes that we’re walking.
But I think if we just bring it all back to God and prayer, I think that He will help reveal to us which direction we need to go.
Kent Sanders 19:48
I like that. It’s a good insight.
Dalene Bickel 19:50
I know I kind of interrupted you earlier. I’m sorry about that. You were saying about other examples that writers can use for being generous; maybe you already threw them in there as of our conversation, but I just wanted to return to that in case there were other things that you wanted to mention there.
Way #2 to Become a Generous Writer
Kent Sanders 20:05
Sure, there’s really two of the things that I want to specifically mention. And really simple things to do, that I think are really effective.
One is, whenever you have a friend who releases a book, I think it’s important to not just buy that book, but also buy some extra copies if you can, or at the very least share that book on social media.
Obviously, you want to leave a review; leave a good review if the book’s good. I think if a book is released and you don’t like it, don’t leave a review. [Bad reviews] just kind of spread negativity, unless you have a really compelling reason to leave a negative review, which I think it has to be a really compelling reason. I think if it’s not a good review, then just keep your opinion to yourself. That’s the way I approach it personally, maybe people can disagree with that, or whatever.
[In addition to] buying a copy (obviously) and leaving a good review, also share it with people, whether that’s doing a giveaway, maybe you talk about it on your podcast, or in a newsletter, or in your group or social media or wherever – just share the love for that person.
Way #3 to Become a Generous Writer
Another thing that is really simple to do – and I think this is super effective – is sending handwritten notes to people. In fact, I’ve got three right here. These are actually notes that are going out to clients whose projects are wrapping up; I always send clients a really nice, highly personalized gift plus a handwritten note. But I send out a handwritten notes all the time [to others as well] because people don’t really do that much anymore.
We all do emails and text. But when was the last time that you got a handwritten card in the mail from somebody?
Whenever we go to the mailbox, what’s the stuff that we always open first? Well, it’s going to be something that’s handed dressed. And when you see that you think, “Oh, my gosh! This person took the time to write out a card or a note and mail it to me. They put a stamp on it; they did the whole thing.”
There’s something very special and unique about that. It didn’t used to be rare. I mean, back when I was a kid, that stuff happened all the time. But now everything is so electronic that for somebody to go to the trouble of sending a note in the mail is actually a rare thing. And it’s so cheap and easy to do.
We’re writers. I mean, this is what we do either for a living or for a side hustle or hobby or whatever it is; doesn’t make any difference. But that is extremely, extremely powerful. And people sometimes even share those on social media.
Dalene Bickel 22:19
Oh, I can imagine. When you asked, “When was the last time you received something?” I’m like, I personally haven’t received something except maybe at Christmas time, you know, the Christmas cards and maybe my birthday. But in general, no. I love that idea. And I think it would just make the highlight of anyone’s day to receive that.
Kent Sanders 22:38
Yeah. I also have personalized stationery made, which is actually really cheap to do. If you have a good printer, you can just do it on your printer; just get some cardstock and do it that way if you want to save money. Or, you can have some printed up for you.
I have this … I think I paid like $25 for this on Amazon. I don’t know what it’s called – I guess you would call it a personalized stamp. So this has my initials on it – I keep rubber bands around this because it comes open if I don’t – then my address on it. So sometimes I’ll stamp the back of an envelope rather than write my return address on it. It just is kind of a cool little thing that sets it apart and makes it look just a little bit distinctive and a little bit more creative. Any touches like that, that you can add to handwritten cards, can really make a big difference.
Dalene Bickel 23:24
And I’m guessing here that you’re not saying we have to write these long missives. It doesn’t have to be two pages long. It’s just whatever is top of mind about that individual; maybe a note of encouragement or a thank you for something that they’ve been generous with you about.
Kent Sanders 23:39
Exactly. So what I do – that’s a really good point – I have these cards I bought on Amazon. They’re 3×5, they have a typewriter on the front; the company is called Peter Pauper Press. And I think the cards are about $1 apiece, maybe like 80 cents or something including an envelope. And they have extra envelopes in the package.
But these are 3×5 so that you can only write just two or three sentences on these. And I intentionally do that because if I feel like I have to fill out this giant card, I’m probably not going to do it. But I sit down and can write these very quickly. Obviously, you’re gonna want to have people’s mailing address, and you could send them out and people love them.
Dalene Bickel 24:18
I love that. Yes, it’s a habit I want to get back into. I had done it a long time ago.
Kent Sanders 24:27
A little trick I want to add here is that I keep this stationery right in front of me on my desk; stamps in front of me right here, too. Anytime that I do a podcast interview or really anything, I always get people’s addresses. So I keep all my contacts on my computer and on my phone so that I always have those in case I need them again. So I keep all the stuff right here so I don’t have to go hunting for stamps or stationery or whatever. Because if you have it all right here you’re going to be way more likely to do it rather than having to feel like, “Well, I’ve got to figure out the stationery. I’ve got to figure out the stamps and all that jazz.” So they’re there and you’ll do it.
Dalene Bickel 25:01
Plus there’s the whole “out of sight, out of mind” thing, right? If you don’t see it, you’re [likely to] forget about it. I was just thinking, what a great thing for your launch team, if you’re launching your book. I mean, they would love that.
I just think everything that you have shared today is so spot on, and simple to implement. And in today’s society, we do need simple, right? Writing takes a lot of time, a lot of effort, a lot of brainpower. So we do need some of those simple things to help us get out of our heads sometimes and connect with other people
Bonus Way to Become a Generous Writer
Kent Sanders 25:38
Totally. And I would also throw in another little thing. I don’t do this enough, but I’ve done it a lot of times, and I pay more attention to it:
Whenever you leave a review for a podcast or a book, take a screenshot of that and then share it on social media.
You’re getting double duty out of it. Not only are you leaving the review itself, but if you post that snapshot of your review, and then tag the person whose podcast or book that you’re reviewing so they see it, they’re going to appreciate it and help spread the word about whatever it is.
Anything that you can do like that, where you get a bunch of wins like that, I think is really significant.
Dalene Bickel 26:32
I don’t know about you, but sometimes I bang my head up against the wall trying to think what should I post about on social media. Well, this is a very simple thing that we can do. And it’s helping others.
Kent Sanders 26:46
I mean, don’t all of us don’t get tired of talking about ourselves? Sometimes you feel like you get on Facebook, or LinkedIn or Instagram, and you’re you’re like, “What am I what am I going to post today?” Well, the answer is, if something interesting happens in your life, of course, that’s worthy of posting about, yes – you have a book launch or something. But to me, the default is, “Hey, let me share something else that somebody else has and comment on their posts or something because I’m not that interesting of a person.” But I see a lot of interesting people in my network in my circle. So let me share the cool things that they’re doing. That, to me is way more interesting.
Dalene Bickel 27:19
I think that all of us, at least most of us, can relate to thinking that we aren’t all that interesting, but then you speak to somebody else and they’re like, “Oh, but I want to hear more about this about you.” So again, I’m encouraging everyone to just take one of these tips that Kent has shared today. Just start implementing that, if nothing else – whichever one really resonated with you – and see where that takes you and how you feel about it. I’ll bet it makes you feel good. We need those little boosts of good factors these days, too.
Kent Sanders 27:50
Totally. And they’re simple; they’re simple and cheap. I mean, you’re talking about stamps and stationery and buying people’s books, which are usually not that expensive. Taking pictures of those, sharing those, leaving reviews for books and podcasts. All those are free or extremely low-cost things to do. But they’re really, really effective.
Dalene Bickel 28:09
Why not? I’m motivated! So I know that many of our listeners might be new to you. And so where can they find out more about you and all of your writing products?
Kent Sanders 28:21
They can go to dailywriterlife.com. There I’ve got a link to my free Daily Writer’s Starter Kit, that’s seven guides on various topics of interest to writers. And once they go through those, then they are actually filtered into my daily email. Every single day, I put out a very short, little email that’s a prompt or some type of inspiration for your writing.
And then I’ve also got a link to my membership community, which is called The Daily Writer Club. That is one of the most fun things that I do; I absolutely love leading that group. We do a call once a week, we do a weekly writing sprint. In fact, I’ve got a retreat coming up here next week. That is my very first in-person retreat for that group. So exciting, fun stuff.
Dalene Bickel 29:05
Perfect. Well, I’m sure some people will be checking that out. Thank you so much for joining us today, Kent. And congratulations on the new book. I hope that it does super well for you.
Kent Sanders 29:16
Thank you. I really appreciate that.
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